Opinions on 'skulking' or 'going to ground'

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TonyB
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Opinions on 'skulking' or 'going to ground'

Post by TonyB »


Long ago in another forum I once read:
Some idiot once wrote:Players that don't skulk are losers. You cannot beat a competent attacker without doing it.
Something like that. I dont' remember the exact wording, but the statement stuck always stuck with me.

without getting into a huge argument about it what are y'alls opinion on skulking, going to ground, moving out of LOF then advancing back in, etc?

Regardless of what I believe about skulking, I believe more strongly that that person's statement is utter bullshite. :lol:
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Bogcheck
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Re: Opinions on 'skulking' or 'going to ground'

Post by Bogcheck »


I'm a relatively new player can someone explain skulking to me? Where is it in rules?
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TonyB
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Re: Opinions on 'skulking' or 'going to ground'

Post by TonyB »


Skulking is a tactic that isn't a rule, but a leveraging of the rules, where a player moves units out of LOS so the other player cannot fire on them in their DFPh, then advances them back into tehir original hex so they are ready to fire on units in the next turn during their DFPh. Its pretty much used only by defencing forces, but not always.
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Neal
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Re: Opinions on 'skulking' or 'going to ground'

Post by Neal »


I'll give my worthless 2 cents on the topic.

First, I agree the statement you quoted is crap. My playing buddy and I are what I would consider "competent" and we almost never skulk and are pretty evenly matched when it comes to wins.

In our games I've used it a few times, and I think it's sort of a standing, unofficial rule that we just don't rely on that crutch. Now if I were to play in a tournament and a setting where it's being used by everyone else...then I would probably use it too. Like the IIFT. :lol:

I certainly don't think it's necessary to win like that guy believes. :roll:

I know skulking is a result of the mechanics of the rules, but I don't believe it's in the spirit of the rules...or the tactical combat the rules are supposed to simulate.

I think a better implementation (and I'm pulling this out of my ass) would be some sort of movement mechanic like "going to ground" where a unit declares "GTG" at the start of their MPh (costing all MF) and are marked with a counter. This gives them a temporary psuedo-TI type status, all fire on them is area fire, they can't move obviously, it doesn't allow them to fire during the AFPh, and doesn't allow them to advance...but they can still be fired on instead of artificially hiding from LOS temporarily. After the APh the "GTG" counter is removed.

I think something like this is more realistic. Soldiers would seek extra cover to hold a position, forfeiting movement and the ability to fire effectively, but allows them to hold positions they want to hold. Soldiers wouldn't step out of the back of the building, have a smoke, wait 5 minutes, then go back in the building.

Again, I'm just spit balling here.

Bottomline, skulking is legal within the mechanics of the rules, but I think it's cheeseball mechanic if used excessively.

That was too long. :?

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aslfaust
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Re: Opinions on 'skulking' or 'going to ground'

Post by aslfaust »


I skulk every time. :lol: Its part of the rules.
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Stryker9-2
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Re: Opinions on 'skulking' or 'going to ground'

Post by Stryker9-2 »


I guess I'm "old school" and not a huge fan of skulking, have seldom if ever used it. In certain rare situations, I can see it possibly being advantageous, but as a defensive strategy? Not so much. All you are avoiding is your opponents Defensive Fire, he will still be able to Prep Fire in the next Player turn.
Neal and I have discussed "skulking" at length and neither of us really believe that there's a huge advantage to using it. Like I said, in certain rare instances, sure. But in general, no. A competent opponent can work his way around it.
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MrBoXcArS
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Re: Opinions on 'skulking' or 'going to ground'

Post by MrBoXcArS »


I've used skulking at very situational times, when it makes sense tactically, not just because it's a crack in the rules that can be used to advantage, whether the rule or lack of one was put in deliberately or by happenstance.
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VaslingStew
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Re: Opinions on 'skulking' or 'going to ground'

Post by VaslingStew »


Agreed, it is allowed in the rules.

The issue is. The game changes and scenario design must change as more and more players use skulking to "break" a scenario design.

How does it break design?
As the number of shorter, tournament style games are produced Skulking becomes an overused tactic and any boards have the Narrow streets built into them allowing the Skulk back into the same great TEM.

As you are limited in time, you have few choices, Sleaze freeze with your tanks and run adjacent...
When the games devolve into skulking and freezing, its not ASL....its a bastardized version.

As you may end up having to PREP....and the games are shorter overall. It becomes DICEY. You either get the shot you need and advance or you simply lose....that's not really a Good Game....spending 4 hours to advance units to Prep once or twice...MEH.

But it is used. And the rules will never change. They haven't fixed the broken rules, I don't expect them to fix rules that others deem a bit "sleazy". Some have easy fixes. Skulking is just one of those that is legal.

Many times skulking can be designed out of a game (terrain that is less conducive for skulking, etc) But then again, I haven't played all scenarios.

Its used, that's about all we can say.
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Esquire
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Re: Opinions on 'skulking' or 'going to ground'

Post by Esquire »


I am the contrarian here. I skulk, every time.

I see opportunities and the utility in nearly every game. I don’t view a skulk as “leveraging” or violating the “spirit” of the rules or as “cheesy.” At all. Rules are binary--they either allow or prohibit an action. IMO, these are simply emotional objections because we don’t “like” something or we disagree. That’s a fine objection, but I don’t see if as a reason to reject a valid ASL tactic.

TBH, I never thought about scenario balance and how skulking may have a negative impact. I always assumed scenarios were balanced through playacting and play testers skulked so there was no net effect.

I wan’t to make sure everyone understands i say this with respect to everyone else’s opinions and views--they are all viable. These are only my opinions. YMMV.
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xenovin
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Re: Opinions on 'skulking' or 'going to ground'

Post by xenovin »


Skulking is a very useful for the defender and usually criticized by players that don't know how to overcome it. You can set up a kill stack and AM or APh some HS or MMCs into the street adjacent to the skulk position and challenge them in their own PFPh or dare them to come back into this position (usually not). Searching or bump tactics with Op Fire kill stack to remove any concealment and zap them if they hang around, key hole shots between buildings or snap shots can also get the skulker fall back if unware LOS exists. Dump smoke in the return location and it doesn't matter if they come back. Enter a vehicle into bypass and freeze them if the return. you have options vs the shulk.
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